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楼主: 朔风

[架空] 最强战士:帝国近卫军马穆鲁克 VS 沙皇近卫哥萨克

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 楼主| 发表于 2017-6-8 02:18:47 | 显示全部楼层
装甲掷弹熊 发表于 2017-6-7 21:28
普拉托夫、奥尔洛夫-杰尼索夫所部在哈瑙都参战过

可见Nafziger的Napoleon at Leipzig

找到这个,是1813年发生在Langengebode附近去往哈瑙路上的战斗,不过未标明出处。http://www.napolun.com/mirror/napoleonistyka.atspace.com/cossacks.htm
In October 1813 near Kassel, three Cossack regiments destroyed the Hussar Regiment ‘Jerôme’ in such a way, that no man or horse managed to escape; a young guard detachment of 3,500 men strong, at Langengebode on the road to Hanau, was attacked by 800 Cossacks. They were pinned down until daybreak, when three Bavarian battalions arrived, taking prisoner the whole detachment; the elimination of the noble Polish Lancer Regiment under General Kanopka at Slonim (in 1812), and many other surprise-attacks executed by Cossacks are well-known.
哥萨克真是突袭高手,毕竟是祖传战法。
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 楼主| 发表于 2017-6-8 02:34:04 | 显示全部楼层
装甲掷弹熊 发表于 2017-6-7 20:18
原文是

看起来真是游

根据多梅尼尔引用古耀将军的笔记,从浅滩涉渡可能性更高。埃斯拉河因暴雨河水大涨,很难想象近卫军的骑兵们穿着军装带着武器拉着战马游过去
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 楼主| 发表于 2017-6-11 04:36:52 | 显示全部楼层
战士资料之近卫哥萨克

战士素养:

近卫哥萨克成员不仅包括“正版”哥萨克,还有从各骑兵部队中精挑细选出来的尖子兵,用哥萨克式装备。由此可见,近卫哥萨克不仅骑术了得,而且身体强健,战斗力高,十分勇敢。

武器装备:

主要武器为骑枪,虽然哥萨克的骑枪比波兰枪骑兵的骑枪还要长,但这丝毫不影响哥萨克对这种武器的熟练掌握。普罗克施写道:
"... the lance is their main weapon. He knows how to use this weapon with great skill and security, nevertheless the fact that it is one and a half foot longer as the Polish lance. He knows how to use his sabre just as well; officers and NCO’s practice them for use against the Turks. The pistol is of less value to him. He considers it not really as a weapon, but only as a tool to scare the enemy. He fires only to fire, not to hit anything, and in common there are few Cossacks which use their pistols... Tettenborn armed his Cossacks completely with French muskets... The Cossack loves the use of a firearm, because of the reason that he fears the one of the enemy. He wants to take artillery with him, and the name Poushki (cannon) is for him a word of joy, as well as of fear...A tenth of every squadron consists of marksmen; Strelki. Rifle and pistols are mostly Turkish or Persian booty." (Prokesch - "Ueber den Kosaken, und dessen Brauchbarkeit im Felde")

由此可见,哥萨克还善用马刀。喜欢使用火器,但并不十分精通。

战例精选:

1812年征俄,波兰枪骑兵曾与哥萨克战斗过
At Smolensk Chlapowski had another encounter with the Cossacks: "From the Emperor's tent we could see all of Smolensk ... There were masses of Cossacks circling in front of the city. Between the French line and the city walls was a massive gully into which the Cossacks had spilled. As I was on duty that day, I was ordered by the Emperor to take a squadron and force the Cossacks wiwthdrew. Coming up out of the ditch on the far side, I deployed the squadron in a single line, as I expected the enemy to shoot at us from the walls. Sure enough, they fired a number of howitzer shells, one of which exploded in the middle of the squadron. A few men were wounded, and some horses broke ranks in fright, so the Cossacks seized the moment to charge us. They were upon us very quickly, and I had to parry one of their lances with my saber. I damaged the lance but did not cut right through it, and it struck my horse's head, wounding it from its ears to the nostrils. Captain Skarzynski accounted for 2 or 3 Cossacks. Cossack lances are longer than ours, and in a close fight they handled less well. Our squadron repulsed this attack and sent the Cossacks back to the shelter of their walls."

哥萨克的骑枪更长,然而其冲击并非不可抵挡。如果运气好,一名同样训练有素的精锐骑兵用马刀格开甚至斩断哥萨克骑枪也是完全有可能的。另外,哥萨克的超长骑枪在近距离格斗中不占优势。不过在骚扰战(skirmish)模式战斗中,哥萨克骑兵可以利用其马快枪长的优点反复冲击,直到击败对手。

1813年莱比锡会战,近卫哥萨克表现神勇,“像赶去参加婚礼”那样参加战斗。

参考资料
http://bbs.napolun.com/thread-25511-1-1.html
http://www.napolun.com/mirror/na ... ce.com/cossacks.htm

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发表于 2017-6-18 13:28:02 | 显示全部楼层
装甲掷弹熊 发表于 2017-6-3 06:17
估计平地哥萨克骑枪能沾点便宜,后两个应该是马穆胜出

单挑的话骑枪优势很大吧

想了下还可以用手枪……
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 楼主| 发表于 2017-6-19 01:11:45 | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 朔风 于 2017-6-19 01:15 编辑

马穆鲁克装备两把手枪,哥萨克更多,但马穆鲁克不经常使用,哥萨克按一些记载更是只用手枪来吓唬人。我觉得原因可能是那时的手枪准度太差,中远距离打不中,距离太近了又不如冷兵器实用。

手枪倒是可以用来放冷枪,比如多梅尼尔在金字塔之战“万军中取上将首级”。
http://bbs.napolun.com/thread-40032-1-1.html




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发表于 2017-7-1 15:50:49 | 显示全部楼层
装甲掷弹熊 发表于 2017-6-3 06:17
估计平地哥萨克骑枪能沾点便宜,后两个应该是马穆胜出

马穆鲁克能算当时欧洲顶尖的用马刀的骑兵吗?
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 楼主| 发表于 2017-7-1 23:32:03 | 显示全部楼层
目前得票是马穆鲁克完胜。

值得注意的是哥萨克常年与土耳其人交战,刀法不会差。史实战例也互有胜败。个人认为胜负难料。
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发表于 2017-7-3 11:58:06 | 显示全部楼层
按恩格斯的说法,所有的轻骑兵都是非正规骑兵,战术要求就是骚扰、追击、偷袭为主,那再谈论谁强谁弱就没有太大的意义了。刚正面的时候,就说明要么战术安排有问题,要么是没人了应急没办法了。
讨论单兵能力的话,也许是马穆鲁克稍微强一点,但是总编制不超过2个中队的马穆鲁克对战局真的是没有太大的用,给拉萨勒2个中队的骠骑兵,可能干得更好。哥萨克最可怕的是他排山倒海的数量啊,量变引起质变,往敌后一扔,得,补给和战场遮断都可以不用烦了。
再说哥萨克的单兵能力也不弱,车臣哭着说我们给打跪了
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 楼主| 发表于 2017-7-4 02:33:12 | 显示全部楼层
呵呵,主要参考了老美同类型关公战秦琼节目,里面的对抗也匪夷所思,有蒙古骑兵大战阿帕奇战士,越共死磕党卫军等等...相比之下,本帖这种架空还稍微合理一点,至少历史上还真有可能交过手
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发表于 2017-7-8 12:39:05 | 显示全部楼层
法国的马穆鲁克好像一开始是有北非人,后来填充进去的都是法国人了吧
战斗力啊武艺有没有变化?
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